Official Luthiers Forum!

Yo, Kim, Joel

Every little drop helps. and eventually the polluting effects ( that would be change) of our evolving consciousness will eventually reach the galactic level and then what? Thats if

a) we don't change the direction of our evolution to sustainability
or
b) mother nature takes over, fries and freezes us as has been prophesised for this Kalpa.


But wait here a min. are we so arrogant to think that we are separate from mother nature? Hmmm...perhaps we fry our selves...just like too many rats in a cage....then what...the thousand years of peace will enter and again the prophecy of peace is fulfilled.

Me, I choose sustainability...by the way I do know of a grate deal on some BRW, if anyone interested.
Now don't that sound like a paradox.

Well yup. It is.

however lets not BS each other any more.

the time has come
We, you and me,
we be the ones we been waiting for
CHOOSE.

blessings
the
Padma

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Audiences and dispensations on Thursdays ~ by appointment only.


.

"Tragedy of the commons" interesting read an germane to the discussion.

Link

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Cut to size.....Beat to fit.....Paint to match.

Indeed and most eloquently bought to the attention of lesser minds Link. We do learn something new every day if we look

Cheers

Kim

I enjoy my cup 'o joe while I am aware that those coffee estates were primitive forests.

I don't think you have to chain yourself to an old-growth tree, or become a Luddite to make a change, and have the change make a difference. I think each small act adds up and becomes significant. At the very least, a gesture that if viewed alone is seen as an act of futility does impact the individual that performed the action. A step before that is intent. Intent is the beginning of the process of creation, and again, even without getting into the metaphysical implications of individual intent or the combined intent of multiple individuals as it expands outward, the initial intent within the individual is significant in the change it creates within the individual.

I was amazed when I read John Robbins' (Pulitzer Price nominated) Diet For A New America. Of course, as one of the initial whistle blowers exposing factory farming/ranching methods, the information itself was eye-opening, but the tone in which the book was written was equally amazing. Rather than taking the stance of finger-pointing toward unethical individuals and corporations (which he had the data to back up), John wrote the book from a loving and forgiving point of view - he challenged us all to stop and recognize where we have gotten, to individually take responsibility, and to collectively begin the process of changing to sustainable and ethical methods of food production. That book and its underlying message impacted me greatly. For me, these lessons cross over into many facets of life, and (other than the times in my life I have allowed myself to lull into a semi-conscious state), I try to incorporate that wisdom.

One of the things about the initial Rainforest Alliance Smartwood program that showed the depth and breadth of the program was the inclusion of specific guidelines regarding how the local human population would be impacted by the timber extraction. It was the first I was aware of something like "Fair Trade" being applied to a resource. Now, we can choose to enjoy a cup 'o joe from conventional, modern coffee plantation grown beans, or from "shade grown" coffee trees grown beneath the understory of taller indigenous trees, (sometimes labeled as "for the birds" or "from a bird sanctuary"), we can choose "organically grown" coffee (I think conventional coffee is #1 on the list of highest pesticide count among agricultural crops), and we can choose "Fair Trade Certified" coffee beans. So, an act as simple as having a cup of coffee offers the potential to make a positive impact (or, if you prefer, a "less negative" impact.)

If we individually ask our tonewood suppliers to source and offer some wood that has a less negative environmental impact, and they hear a collective voice from a number of their buyers, I'm sure they will accommodate us. LMI already sells Forest Stewardship Council (FSC) certified tonewood. (FSC is the newer, umbrella organization that now oversees certification of goods from the Smartwood program and Green Cross program, among others.) We'll need to ask, and be patient, as it may take our suppliers a while to source, purchase, and acquire responsibly harvested timber - and comply with any chain of custody documentation that the certifiers require in order to sell the wood as certified. Then, we must be prepared to pay a bit more, well, maybe more than "a bit" more in some cases. Luckily, in lutherie, the labor far outweighs the cost of materials, and it would be easy to pass on the costs (and part of the good karma) to the consumer. Then, luthiers advertising and marketing including a discussion of environmental impact could be more the norm than a rarity, and that in turn would reach out and impact the buyers (at least to give them the choice.)

In addition to the certified sources for timber, some tonewood vendors are already sourcing wood that has a lower environmental impact. I know that Tim Spittle of Australian Tonewoods extracts some of his lumber basically from the leftovers from conventional logging, and I know that Grant Goltz buys Cocobolo from trees downed by hurricanes, and Dave Maze sources urban reclaimed lumber. So even the smaller tonewood vendors can supply us with more socially responsible options.

Dennis

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Dennis Leahy
Duluth, MN, USA
7th Sense Multimedia

There is a forrest on Madagascar with my name on it?

Sorry...

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Rian Gitar og Mandolin

Though they probably have reasons to keep them private, I'd be interested to see the sales numbers from a place like LMII for the FSC and non-FSC versions of the same product.

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Bob Garrish
Former Canonized Purveyor of Fine CNC Luthier Services

I'm glad this topic came up once again (the overall topic, not just as it pertains to Madagascar) as it offered a new chance to ponder this. For me, and the quandary that I described, the outcome was to gift the ivory to a gifted artisan friend that restores old stringed musical instruments. The Brazilian Rosewood set that I have, I will use, and will build a guitar that stays in my family - where, in my living room, it can be appreciated, where is is known to be material acquired well before the species was listed as endangered, and where it will not be in the public eye where it could have influenced others to consider buying Brazilian Rosewood (of possible dubious origin.)

I also realize that I will face this issue again and again, as the various species that I already have in my possession are listed as threatened or endangered. For example, I have several H. Mahogany sets, and a number of sets from species that are likely at some point to at least be considered as threatened (Koa, Cocobolo, Bocote, Ziricote, Katalox...) I think that Kim's observation, "...accept that i was a man of my time when i made the purchase and things are as they should be but also accept i am a man of my time today and will buy no more.", captures the spirit. Other than someone that purposely races to horde a stash of a species that they know is about to be listed as threatened or endangered (violating the "spirit of the law"), I think the best we can do is to honor the wood by building the best instruments we can with what we have, and keep an eye and an ear out, sensitive to the ecological big picture and to individual species survival before making further purchases.

Dennis

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Dennis Leahy
Duluth, MN, USA
7th Sense Multimedia

Dennis, I think that is exactly the right course of action for you. When you bought wood if it was a legitimate purchase at the time then you have no guilt to feel, build with it and enjoy it, just buy no more.

Colin

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I don't believe in anything, I simply make use of a set of reasonable working hypotheses.

Onya Dennis